tag:blogger.com,1999:blog-9864334.post7171855751487814975..comments2023-10-24T05:49:04.269-04:00Comments on The Chaliceblog: Our collective complexChalicechickhttp://www.blogger.com/profile/07781469958573869914noreply@blogger.comBlogger13125tag:blogger.com,1999:blog-9864334.post-10371534117391476682007-09-20T10:21:00.000-04:002007-09-20T10:21:00.000-04:00:::thumbs up at Miss Kitty::::::thumbs up at Miss Kitty:::PeaceBanghttps://www.blogger.com/profile/11431551457505981195noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-9864334.post-86212632882507560302007-09-12T09:39:00.000-04:002007-09-12T09:39:00.000-04:00...because we are each the center of our own unive...<EM>...because we are each the center of our own universe, and we see things from our own point of view.</EM><BR/><BR/>So were a self-centered faith to the point we're myopic?<BR/><BR/>I've certainly met these personalities in UU Churches, although I think they're exceptions rather than a majority.<BR/><BR/>My wife and I chuckle when we meet fellow the occasional UU who assume if you agree on A, you agree on B, and C...right on through Z, and will ramble on through a whole range of discontents assuming you're in perfect agreement. (Ok, maybe these folks are more typical than I thought).<BR/><BR/>If you politely disagree, the surprize throws them so off balance with surprize. They've lost the ability to politely and rationally counter. And in large part because they fear offending.<BR/><BR/>We've lost the art of discourse and civil argumentation. <BR/><BR/>Our Social Justice committee agreed (save me) that that the majority of the congregation <EM>did not think</EM> about issues of War and Peace.<BR/><BR/>It was strange they'd think that of an obviously educated and involved congregation. <BR/><BR/>What they saw as indifference (and an indifference that left them feeling a bit on-the-outs) among the congregation was in fact evidence of the congregation fufilling our covenant to gather, <EM>...not as agreeing in opinion, - not as having attained universal truth in belief or perfection in character, but as seekers after Truth & Goodness</EM>.Bill Baarhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/07095486926836836714noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-9864334.post-80916162161780276972007-09-12T00:41:00.000-04:002007-09-12T00:41:00.000-04:00Ms kitty -- Great description!CC- People have a h...Ms kitty -- Great description!<BR/><BR/>CC- People have a hard time with it because we are each the center of our own universe, and we see things from our own point of view. Not many people train themselves to see the viewpoints of others.Anonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-9864334.post-58755150675944928182007-09-12T00:20:00.000-04:002007-09-12T00:20:00.000-04:00I don't have an answer to the barn question. But t...I don't have an answer to the barn question. But thank you for introducing me to the word "salvific."Lisa M. Orangehttps://www.blogger.com/profile/14153605453047620881noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-9864334.post-20587304623407489692007-09-11T16:27:00.000-04:002007-09-11T16:27:00.000-04:00As you've pointed out, there's a sense of entitlem...As you've pointed out, there's a sense of entitlement which stifles compromise. I don't know where it's written that says that every being gets everything he or she wants at all times. <BR/><BR/>If UUs insist upon this fallacy of thought, then they will only encapsulate themselves in smaller and smaller boxes and numbers.Comrade Kevinhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/11393718048145784837noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-9864334.post-38081608155105453632007-09-11T15:04:00.000-04:002007-09-11T15:04:00.000-04:00:Because we don't do a very good job explaining ho...:Because we don't do a very good job explaining how to dissent or accepting dissenters.<BR/><BR/><A HREF="http://groups.google.ca/groups?hl=en&q=Unitarians%20and%20the%20dissent%20of%20%22Robin%20Edgar%22.%20.%20.&ie=UTF-8&oe=UTF-8&um=1&sa=N&tab=wg" REL="nofollow">No kidding</A>. . .<BR/><BR/>:Most UUs prefer to avoid confrontation.<BR/><BR/>As evidenced by the fact that a whole "church" full of U*Us has totally ignored my legitimate dissent, including a long term public protest, for well over a decade now. . . <BR/><BR/>:Evangelicals seek it out and prepared to take whatever flack retuned their way.<BR/><BR/>Well I am pretty good at <A HREF="http://groups.google.ca/groups/search?hl=en&ie=UTF-8&oe=UTF-8&q=%22CULT+IS+A+FOUR+LETTER+WORD%22+Unitarians.+.+.&qt_s=Search" REL="nofollow">retuning U*U flak</A>. Does that make me an Evangelical? ;-)<BR/><BR/>:They're up for the fight. We're shy. <BR/><BR/>Or just plain cowardly. . . <BR/><BR/>Don't take that personally Bill it is not directed at you.<BR/><BR/>You're right Kitty U*Us don't need to change their core purported principles, purposes and ideals. . . They just have to dio a better job of putting them into practice and that includes you Ms. Kitty.Robin Edgarhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/06208142626285495635noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-9864334.post-72421833459690709872007-09-11T13:22:00.000-04:002007-09-11T13:22:00.000-04:00I mean flak...I mean flak...Bill Baarhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/07095486926836836714noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-9864334.post-76347377245871169702007-09-11T13:21:00.000-04:002007-09-11T13:21:00.000-04:00Why do so many of us get off on feeling so persecu...<EM>Why do so many of us get off on feeling so persecuted...</EM><BR/><BR/>Because we don't do a very good job explaining how to dissent or accepting dissenters.<BR/><BR/>Most UUs prefer to avoid confrontation.<BR/><BR/>Evangelicals seek it out and prepared to take whatever flack retuned their way.<BR/><BR/>They're up for the fight. We're shy.Bill Baarhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/07095486926836836714noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-9864334.post-57049788518700715912007-09-11T11:24:00.000-04:002007-09-11T11:24:00.000-04:00CC and Ms. Kitty,This was turning into a very long...CC and Ms. Kitty,<BR/><BR/>This was turning into a very long reply to your comments -- instead of posting it here, I've put in on my blog:<BR/><BR/>How Do Our Churches Survive in a Non-Religious World?<BR/>http://liberalfaith.blogspot.com/2007/09/how-do-our-churches-survive-in-non.html<BR/><BR/>Take care,<BR/>SteveSteve Caldwellhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/12333184436301854794noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-9864334.post-60684473941912046462007-09-11T10:30:00.000-04:002007-09-11T10:30:00.000-04:00I think most of what's discussed in the UU blogosp...I think most of what's discussed in the UU blogosphere has been around for a while in terms of topics in some form or another. I remember similar discussions in seminary and before that in YRUU/LRY.... Not that it makes it less interesting. <BR/><BR/>And I'd like to add sympathy for the minister involved in fielding the questions.Stephaniehttps://www.blogger.com/profile/18040824813209082919noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-9864334.post-81152762944573212352007-09-11T09:39:00.000-04:002007-09-11T09:39:00.000-04:00CC,I'll bet the ministers in the porch chat just q...CC,<BR/>I'll bet the ministers in the porch chat just quietly and internally sighed at the shortsightedness of this questioner. I'll bet they've heard that type of thing so often that it makes them slightly nauseated. I know I have.<BR/><BR/>We are doing religion in a whole new way, not around a set of beliefs about a deity but around how we treat other people, other living things, and the planet. We don't need to change our core (and I think we do have this core of precepts about treating others and the planet well); we do need to make it more accessible and help people understand that THIS is UUism, not humanism, not Christianity, not paganism. UUism is a religion dedicated to treating LIFE with LOVE.Lilylouhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/02328027965155428624noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-9864334.post-63967391158265218102007-09-11T09:16:00.000-04:002007-09-11T09:16:00.000-04:00CC, There are probably many cases where it is not ...CC, <BR/><BR/>There are probably many cases where it is not the particular theological orientation of a UU congregation that keeps it from growing. Instead, it's structural things like...the lack of summer worship services (as Elizabeth mentioned recently), a low-quality web presence, not enough attention to welcoming and integrating newcomers, etc.Anonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-9864334.post-25678932171271476112007-09-11T08:36:00.000-04:002007-09-11T08:36:00.000-04:00CC,Why do UUs feel so persecuted? My theory is th...CC,<BR/><BR/>Why do UUs feel so persecuted? My theory is that it's bc. it's the Denomination of Last Resort, the refuge for wounded birds. The Island of Lost Toys, if you remember Rudolph. This, of course, is both a strength (it's a wonderful sausage-like mix) and a weakness (it's in danger of being so tolerant that it stands for nothing). <BR/><BR/>So many UUs are fleeing the persecution from something else in searching for solace.<BR/><BR/>WillWillhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/00370246548842255062noreply@blogger.com